Michigan’s economy benefits from cheap Ontario power

Two Auditors General in Ontario have noted that the government never did any cost-benefit study on its renewable energy program; moreover, wind power is produced out-of-phase with demand in Ontario, and is a significant portion of the surplus power the province is forced to sell off cheap. Parker Gallant comments on who is really benefitting from Ontario’s energy management policies.

Wind turbines near SS Marie: power supply sell-off  (National Post photo)
Wind turbines near SS Marie: power supply sell-off (National Post photo)

Michigan outperforms Ontario. And why not? They have our cheap power

Parker Gallant Energy Perspectives

September 6, 2016

The state of Michigan is outperforming Ontario. That’s according to a recent study by the Fraser Institute. Since the end of the “’Great Recession” Michigan has out performed Ontario, increasing their GDP in 2013 by 2.8% versus Ontario’s growth of only 1.3%.  Unemployment levels in Michigan are currently at 4.6% versus Ontario’s 6.4%. Those are two very important  economic indicators.

That news plus the fact Ontario has become a “have not” province in Canada, it seems policies adopted by the Ontario Liberal government to “build Ontario up” is having the opposite effect.

One of those policies resulted in Ontario’s electricity sector focusing on acquisition of renewable energy from industrial-scale wind turbines, solar panels and biomass. The passing of the Green Energy Act (GEA) in 2009 resulted in adding intermittent and unreliable renewable energy that is unresponsive to demand (wind power is produced out-of-phase with demand in Ontario).   This had the effect of driving down the price of electricity.

The free market trading (HOEP) of electricity has resulted in Ontario exporting a rising percentage of our generation to buyers in Quebec, NY and Michigan, with the latter the biggest buyer.   In 2015 Michigan purchased 10,248 gigawatts (GWh) or enough to power1.1 million “average” Ontario residential households. We sold it at an average of 2.36 cents per kilowatt hour (kWh) and were paid $242 million, but it cost Ontario’s ratepayers just over $1 billion.

Michigan doesn’t have to pay the Global Adjustment. You do.

Michigan appears delighted to be able to purchase our cheap subsidized electricity. Now they are seeking further transmission links to Ontario with an eye on the grid out of Sault Ste Marie.

Read the entire article here.

Comments

notinduttondunwich
Reply

Absolutely disgusting that there was was no cost analysis done on this project… just so irresponsible and unethical to put forth such a massively expensive project without even considering that excessive hydro selloff would be such a factor…. I guess if there’s no proof of them knowing this would happen then no one is really responsible. ….. just another liberal oversight…. oops sorry folks we never thought of that!!!!! Just so sick of being run into the ground by this government! !!!
If anyone else ran a business like the liberals are running hydro none and Ontarions tax money the Canada Revenue Agency would have you arrested for fraud and immediately jailed!!!! What an outrage!!!! So sick of this sh$t

Zel
Reply

Why don’t they use the money paid by the USA to lower our electricity costs?

notinduttondunwich
Reply

They can’t because they are basically giving it away…… then when we have to import electricity we pay them more than we sold it to them…. what we retain back money wise is 1/5 th the cost of what we sold it for….

billycanuk
Reply

I know of a local farmer with a bunch of solar panels. He is paid by the Ontario government 80 cents a Kwh. Then the government sells it for 2.6 cents a KwH. The loss is 77.4 cents per KwH. Who pays that? Well, it’s you and me that makes up that difference! Go figure. There is so much complaining about the Liberal government and whining and moaning but WHAT CAN WE DO TO END IT. Stop the bitching and START DOING SOMETHING TO END IT. What can we do?

Barbara
Reply

DTE Energy is not in the transmission business. They have to pay a transmission company for electricity brought in from outside their service territory.

How much they have to pay for electricity from transmission companies is unknown. Sault Ste Marie is way out of their service territory.

So it has to be a transmission company at the Sault but DTE and other companies may have to guarantee to take the electricity from Canada for the connection/transmission to take place.

Barbara
Reply

DTE is looking for power supplies from outside their service territory to cover expected shortfalls when their coal fired plants are shut down.

This may not turn out to be cheap power but at least it’s power.

Barbara
Reply

In 2012 Michigan voted down “25 by 25” renewables.

Then the ENGOs went to the courts and got around the vote. This resulted in the present DTE situation where the company now has to find outside sources of power when their coal fired plants are shut down.

Barbara
Reply

In 2012 one of the parties involved in the DTE situation contributed $275,000 to a Michigan lobbying firm to promote renewable energy in Michigan.

Source from U.S. IRS Form 990.

Barbara
Reply

The same party that made the above Michigan contribution has an interlocking board of directors/trustees with a Canadian organization (B.C.) that is/ has been partly funded by a Toronto based foundation.

Barbara
Reply

Same U.S. party that made the above contribution has published on the internet “We have disrupted the energy supply.” Published online 2016.

Andre Lauzon
Reply

Bilycanuck…….you ask “what can we do”. At the present the only thing we can do is a massive march on Queen’s Park and call for Wynne’s resignation.. We also need “recall laws”…………if any Gov’t as the guts.

notinduttondunwich
Reply

Queens park = wasted time money and effort. … this is a human rights issue… people are being forced by our liberal government to decide whether to pay hydro or eat…. to pay hydro or miss the morgage payment… to pay hydro or go without another necessity…. bad enough that were being hydro hijacked but you have to pay HST ontop of that too !!!! Thought hydro was a necessity ……. Nice Katty Wynnd…. really nice…. shame on you!!!!

Sommer
Reply

People are also being forced against their will to live within industrial wind power stations and having their bodies exposed to audible noise, low frequency noise and infrasound radiation.
Yes, this is a crime.

notinduttondunwich
Reply

Funny how Mr treadeau has lots to say about China’s human rights violations when he’d doing that to his own people!!

Tracy
Reply

Thank you Sommer.
No health studies either……
When I’m dead, the money really doesn’t matter.

Leasa
Reply

We fought hard against the turbines long before the companies broke ground here. Now every single window I look out has turbines as far as the eye can see. We did it all and yet here they are as is our huge hydro bill every month. FRUSTRATED AND ANGRY doesn’t even begin to cover it!

notinduttondunwich
Reply

Yes Leasa….
Even tho we have more than enough power to supply all of Ontario plus 1.5 million US customers the liberal leadersh#t feels it is necessary to procure more and more wind and solar projects over the next 5 to 10 years…. those of you who unfortunately have to live with the turdbines will be forced to endure even more….. maybe 250 meters closer this time….. I am inspired by each and everyone of you who are forced to endure these monstrosities and the ill wealth they spread amongst rural communities…

BBB
Reply

This web site is funded by the nuclear lobby groups to block wind energy from replacing the most expensive energy (nuclear)…And you fools are falling for it. Wind energy is the absolute cheapest form of electricity in north america. I know this because i buy and sell power in 12 countries. This article is propaganda.

Wind Concerns Ontario
Reply

We are funded by the nuclear power lobby? Wow, we are definitely not getting all our mail — those cheques are not getting through.

ScepticalGord
Reply

Back in 2008, most people thought wind turbines were a great idea and any naysayer had a screw loose.
And, at the time, the WCO website didn’t draw flies …

Fast forward to 2016 and the WCO boards are racking up comments by the dozens as public knowledge of the follies of wind energy grows exponentially.
And, the flies have finally found WCO, in the form of gnats, trolls hired by the very worried wind industry and its government enablers.

Congrats WCO and others, you have turned the tide of public opinion, buzzing bugs notwithstanding.

BBB
Reply

Quebec has he cheapest power in Canada because they get most of their energy from hydro and wind (over 4GW from wind). …and Quebec. export way more power to the U.S than Ontario does. Ontario has most expensive power because we get 60% from nuclear and only 6% form wind. We are the only province that heavily relies in nuclear. Quebec closed their only nuclear reactor earlier this year to further reduce costs. It was the conservative government that build out 3 nuclear power plants and the liberal government got stuck holding the bag. Now propaganda like this blames the liberals, to get them out, in order that the conservatives can slide back in and build more nuclear. You are all being manipulated.

BBB
Reply

Hang on a second here…According to the U.S Government Department of Energy, Ontario sells the least amount of power to the U.S compared to all of the other Provinces. In other words, other Canadian provinces are selling way more energy at the same prices. This includes Quebec, that generates much of its energy form wind power. Why is WindConcernsOntario trying to suggest wind power is bad and that selling energy to the U.S on the spot market is bad ? …and why does this web site NEVER discuss the real reason our energy prices in Ontario are so high ? (due to nuclear power)….You should all be very concerned.

Barbara
Reply

But we already know that Ontario sells the least power to the U.S.

Barbara
Reply

NEB, Electricity Exports and Imports Summary 2015

http://www.neb-one.gc.ca/index-eng.html

Use search & enter: electricity exports >” Electricity Exports and Imports Summary 2015″

“While net exports of electricity surpassed previous levels, net revenues did not increase proportionally.”

Use internet search: ” NEB 2015 Electricity Exports and Imports Summary”

Alberta does import electricity from the U.S but does not export power to the U.S. according to the NEB.

BBB
Reply

Energy Fact:
In Canada there are only 5 nuclear power generating stations.
Three of them are in Ontario. One is in New Brunswick and the last, which was recently closed down, is located in Quebec.
Is it a coincidence that Quebec has the cheapest energy prices while remaining non-reliant on nuclear power ?…Quebec generates “most” of its energy from hydro and wind power.
On the other extreme, Ontario has the “highest” energy prices and generates 60% of its electricity from nuclear.
In the wake of the Fukushima disaster in Japan in 2011, we had to set aside $20 BILLION to deal with nuclear disaster and to decommission the plants and to fund the long term storage of the toxic waste produced. Is it possible this set aside emergency fund also affects our “current” energy prices because of our reliance on nuclear power?
You should also know that unlike Quebec, Ontario generates less than 6% of our energy from wind and only 3% accounted to FIT contracts awarded at high rates…The rest is purchase on the spot market at the lowest rates in Canada. But this web site won’t tell you that.
But before you start attacking the Liberal party for positioning us to be so reliant on nuclear power, you should know that it was the Provincial Conservative party that moved forward with the building of all three nuclear plants, just before the Liberals were elected into power. In other words, the Lib’s were handed this expensive mess, yet are the ones left holding the toxic bag.
And each time the Liberal party tries to emulate what our friends in Quebec are doing, by advancing more wind power projects that represent the absolute cheapest form of energy in this part of the world, they are blocked from doing so from NIMBY groups like the ones this web site supports and creates. This web site is pure propaganda.
Why is this…and why are we constantly being told by Postmedia/the National Post that wind power is so expensive and bad, when it seems to be working quite well in Quebec… and why does the National Post NEVER identify that nuclear power is the real reason our energy prices are so high ?
We’re being fed a bunch of horse shit by the media about why our energy prices are so high. They’re trying to distract us from the real reasons, in an effort to affect the outcome of the next election, to position us for even higher energy prices from their Conservative, nuclear friends. It’s outright manipulation and most of the public (like you) are falling for it. If you take a moment not to believe everything you read in the newspaper while not joining the Wynne pile on witch hunt, you will realize alleviating our dependence on nuclear power and shifting towards renewables is economic, common sense.

Parker Gallant
Reply

Hey BBB or is it BS? Not one of your claims can be backed up with facts. You fail to link to any site to back up your spurious claims which means, you did no research. As one tiny example 97% of electricity generated in Quebec is hydro power! And where is the link to the claim that the Liberals “set aside” $20 billion. OPG has been setting aside Nuclear fixed asset removal and nuclear waste management funds for years and that fund now sits at $15.5 billion and the price of delivered nuclear electricity from OPG is less than half of unreliable and intermittent wind generation. You do realize that electricity generated by wind turbines is really old technology having been developed a year before the diesel engine. It never caught on because of its unreliability but now that people like you promote it and get rich off it, our electricity rates have skyrocketed. You and windbuddy should spend some time trying to educate yourselves.

Barbara
Reply

EIA

‘West Coast wind patterns lead to below-normal wind generation capacity factors’

Wind patterns can change and then this becomes a factor in IWT electricity production.

Ontario needs reliable sources of electricity.

http://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.cfm?id=22452

T3
Reply

BBB, let’s talk about the millions of dollars in subsidies associated with the construction of the wind turbines and who exactly profited from that..
My tax dollars were used to build a turbine development that forced me from my home. Low frequency waves emitted from the wind turbines almost killed me. My health, my life, will never be the same..This is okay???
This is a crime. This is blood money. This is not ethical. Where are my rights? Apparently they have been flushed down the toilet.
You Liberals are desperate. Will Katie run like Dalton did? Lock her and the rest of the bandits up up until she proves innocence.

T3
Reply

Free-far-all Friday today on AM 740 Zoomer Radio with Libby Znaimer…should be interesting.

Leasa, I’m sorry about your situation. This is an example of how people work.
Industrial wind turbines are not new to Ontario. This has been going on for years. Until the problem effects oneself; others do not care what is going on outside of their bubble.
People only wake up when it hits their pocket book; there it is, that greed factor again.
I’ll say it again..”I told you so..”
On Monday, Katie will dictate the throne speech written for her. “Thou shalt bend over Ontario…” Trudeau will be holding her hand. She’ll continue to play the shell game with our money and label “the new bogus funds” with another fancy name.
We will hear words and terms common to the vocabulary of the liars I mean Liberals, “global warming, green energy, infrastructure, transparency..” yeah right. Ontario will lap it up again like good little puppies.
…and the painted ponies continue to go up and down…

windbuddy
Reply

Well done BBB! You won’t get far with this crowd though. Gallant and his Generals will dig into their files and come back with a canned reply that will make no sense. Gallant’s gullible village idiot: Nutinduttondunwich will assume his usual position. He will emerge from his cave, swear, threaten, lie, try to be funny, and use a whole lot of space and not say anything meaningful. The anti-wind posters on this site have had their day. They have lost. Infrasound, low frequency waves……..what crap. So not believable. So only wind turbines generate this unique anomaly? No other piece of equipment in the world produces this result?

Barbara
Reply

This website does not advocate for nuclear power but costs of the various Ontario sources of power are discussed.

Quebec has hydro-power and Ontario does not.

Wind and solar have zero reliability and this is why this issue is discussed here.

Rural Ontarians have nothing to say about where renewable energy projects are installed. Do you think this is right?

There is a possibility that some IWT installations could affect rural water supplies. Where do you get your water from?

If it was my well in this situation, I’d never let the government have a sample my water.

Barbara
Reply

Ontario does not have the hydro-power supply that Quebec has.

Sami Hearn ORTON
Reply

Worlds going to hell in a waste basket ! ❤️

notinduttondunwich
Reply

Turdbine buddy your hilarious!!!! We might all be living in caves soon enough the way you and BBB and yer bedbudddies the liberals run things!!! At least its a constant 15 deg in my cave…. no need for AC!!!! Again turdbine buddy when was the last time you saw a freaking water turbine jacked 51 stories in the air??? of course wind turbines create infrasound!!!!! Dumbass!!!
Are you that simple you dont believe there is infrasound ???? Again a statement that comes from arrogance and ignorance! !! Your turdbines don’t create any infrasound??? I bet you dont shoot your mouth off in your own municipality!!!! I know that you are scared that you and BBB’s liberal windscam is going to end!!! You continue to troll this website but what for!!??? You’re scared that the rural residents of Ontario are gonna stop your windscam cheque????You accuse me of wasting space on this site but here you are again trying to rundown people saying that thier health concerns are hogwash!!! Where are you from??? I bet you wouldn’t walk around your town with my sign I made for you!!! I find it hard to believe that No one in your area has any issues!!! As for you BBB you keep selling hydro to all those countries!!! You’re scared that the cheap flow of hydro that you sell to the US is gonna end!! That’s why YOU’RE on this site!!!! I gotta go and sweep the floor of my cave!!!!

Bruce Miller
Reply

After six years of planning and preparations Ontario Power Generation (OPG) says it is “ready to execute” refurbishment of the Darlington nuclear power plant and remains within the CAD 12.8 billion ($9 billion) estimate for the project, which is to start next month. 02 September 2016
The 40-month project to refurbish unit 2 will be the first of four such outages as all four of the plant’s Candu units are refurbished over the next ten years.
http://www.world-nuclear-news.org/C-OPG-ready-to-go-with-Darlington-refurbishment-0209167.html

T3
Reply

Trolls on this site are deliberately provoking. They are desperate low life.
Lease holders may require taking down the turbines sooner then later..there goes the family farm!
Btw..Laser tattoo removal is a photo acoustical procedure to remove unwanted tattoos. It doesn’t burn, but breaks up the cells. (just as does infrasound-low frequency waves.)
Does the same to cells and bone. Which is emitted from the turbines.The immune system disposes of the waste.
Vibroacoustic disease…been around for years. Check it out

T3
Reply

Turbine lease holders are every bit as guilty of the crimes committed as are the companies and the government.
We are at war people. It is a silent war: same objectives of other wars but with a weapon uncommon to most – electromagnetic fields and infrasound.
For anyone living in the vicinity of iwts, get a cat scan and see how many lesions have developed in your brain. Memory loss, dementia; oh yes let’s attribute that to aging..premature aging it is. Get your cortisol level checked while you’re at it.. Simple blood work. “The proof is in the pudding” so it goes.
Infrasound breaks down tissue and bones. What I have seen with people living in a turbine development; diabetes, heart attack, stroke and dementia is very prevalent. Gaining weight as well? Myself..try 30+ lbs in the year and a half I was living next to the wind turbines. I was also anemic.
Some people have no idea they are slowly being fried. What an excellent attack eh?
However, lease holders are as guilty of – let’s call it “manslaughter”, as are the companies and the government. The lawyers will have a hey day!
This horrific nightmare rural Ontario is currently living today, will definitely be an event our children and grandchildren will read about in the history books. It will be known as the downfall of Ontario; the biggest government scam and tragedy to Ontario to this date.
I am determined to live long enough to see this through to the end. I live for the day I will meet eye to eye with my cowardly attackers.
Yes, I have become miserable. I am bitter. I have had enough. I don’t care what people think of my sour attitude. I don’t give a crap about much any more. But, be assured , I will not give up. My kids and grandchildren have been harmed; they now will pay for this mess in many ways.
There will be justice…nothing is forever.
“Karma’s a bitche”

Get off this site trolls, your bs is not welcome. Crawl back to your holes. It is only a matter of time… holes will be known to you as your dungeon.

windbuddy
Reply

T3, thank you for the information. Read the abstract from April 2004 Medline : Vibroacoustic Disease: I guess we must eliminate the use of aircraft (aircraft technicians are vulnerable to VAD), commercial or military pilots (constant exposure to low frequency noise). Same goes for the use of ships ( ship machinists are exposed to LFN). We will have to close all restaurants ( restaurant workers are exposed to LFN). I could go on. As is typical of anti-wind BS on this site, you are so focused on wind energy that when you provide your misguided examples of what you think is detrimental about wind, you fail to see the common examples of low frequency noise emitters and the uses of laser technology that are around us every day. Oh, and don’t come back and say that people are only exposed to laser, LFN, and VAD possibilities during their work day and that they can recover when they get to their homes. Posters on this site have characterised wind as being intermittent, only operating 15% of the time, so any horrible exposure would only be present 15% of the time….. much less than a typical work day.

Parker Gallant
Reply

“One recognizable wind turbine pattern is a tonal signal of sharply rising and falling pulses in the infrasound range, (typically about 0.75 Hz, 1.5 Hz, 2.25 Hz, 3.0 Hz, and so on). It is produced by the blade passing the tower. At this frequency these pulses may be “felt or sensed” more than “heard” by the ears. Research by Dr. Alec Salt and others has demonstrated that subaudible infrasound does result in a physiological response from various systems within the body.”

notinduttondunwich
Reply

Still trying to convince everyone of the health benefits of the IWT’S eh turdbine buddy….. your mom n dad leave you all alone fer the day again…. hope you don’t eat all the cookies in the cookie jar!!!! You’ll get in trouble!!!!!

http://m.huffpost.com/ca/entry/11949822

It’s not just Ontario that the liberals are sinking!!!
Obviously being flooded off your land is worse…. or is it???? Same story different province… liberals take liberties on all Canadians when and where ever they please!!!

notinduttondunwich
Reply

So turdbine buddy you now admit that there is infrasound …. because a couple posts ago …..

“Infrasound, low frequency waves……..what crap. So not believable.”
You said that right???

Are you bi polar or has all the turdbines around your house affecting your memory???!!!
One minute you say not believable then you do believe it and it’s only 15% of the time…….
so you do or do not recognize that IWT’S cause infrasound???
You know what….. forget it…. aren’t there any cartoons on to keep you busy!!!!

Barbara
Reply

Let the trolls come. Posters have plenty of correct information to share with them.

Barbara
Reply

Urban Ontarians have a direct or indirect stake in these issues. Let’s hear from them as well.

Richard Mann
Reply

Here is a “time line” showing the history of Wind Turbine Noise problems, going back as far as 1979. Each entry provides documentation:
http://cdn.knightlab.com/libs/timeline/latest/embed/index.html?source=0Ak2bgr7C0nhPdGR3S1lEekU3T3p4ZDhUNDdRV2Y2ZkE&font=Bevan-PotanoSans&maptype=toner&lang=en&height=650

1979 “First complaints received from a dozen families within a 3km radius of turbine”.
1981 “Wind turbine operation creates enormous sound pressure waves”
1982 “Closed windows and doors do not protect occupants from LFN”
1982 “NASA research on human impacts provided to wind industry”
1985 “Hypothesis for infrasound-induced motion sickness”
1987 “Wind industry told that dB(A) unsuitable to measure LFN emissions from wind turbines”

2004 “Wind industry knows noise models inadequate” (from Vestas)

2011 “Vestas knew that low frequency noise from larger turbines needed greater setbacks”

notinduttondunwich
Reply

TURDBINE BUDDY i spoke to my buddies who work in a couple of the professions you mentioned….. I asked them about effects of the LFN and I kinda found out something really interesting. …..
ALL MY FRIENDS CHOOSE TO WORK IN THOSE PROFESSIONS….. T3 AND THOUSANDS OF ONTARIONS LIKE ME DON’T GET TO CHOOSE!!!!
NO CHOICE BUD!!!!
NONE!!!!

Barbara
Reply

KENS 5, San Antonio, April 14, 2016

‘Alamo 2 solar farm damaged by Tuesday’s hail storm’

“looks like close to a quarter of the Alamo 2” project damaged.

Rooftop solar panels were also damaged by this same hail storm.

Article has photos.

http://www.kens5.com/news/local/alamo-2-solar-farm-damaged-by-tuesdays-hail-storm/133803902

More updated information on the damage done to solar panels by this hail storm on the internet.

notinduttondunwich
Reply

Shouldn’t there be less hailstorms and tornadoes because the wind and solar projects are cleaning up all the global warming????

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